Patrick Johnson wrote...
> Imagine the table surface is vertical and you're trying to balance the
> object ball on the cue ball, which is stuck to the end of your stick.

Just be careful not to imagine the table tipping over and crushing you.

Since we've all had so much fun debating Jason's theories about spin transfer and tip/ball contact time, I thought I'd propose some more nonsense (IMO) for discussion.

THE DRAW SHOT MYTH DEBUNKED
Most people cannot draw the ball, therefore it must not be possible. What is commonly referred to as "draw" is actually an optical illusion caused by our expectations that a moving cueball will keep moving in the same direction.

ALL BALLS ARE GRAY
I know a player that is color-blind. He is a good player, and since he says that all of the balls are gray, it must be true.

THE 100 MPH BREAK SHOT
All this talk we've been hearing about 25-30 mph being the maximum break shot speed must be wrong. It sure seems faster to me, so it must indeed be faster.

THE HALF-BALL HIT SIDE POCKET SHOT
I don't really think we've completely covered this issue.

THE NINE BALL ON THE BREAK
The odds against this are astronomical! All those balls banging into each other in just the right way to drive the nine, from the CENTER of the rack, into a 4.5" pocket? Preposterous. I don't think we'll ever see it in our lifetimes.

SLATE
If you think about it, having a material that magically "just happens" to be exactly what we need to make our table beds out of seems pretty "lucky" doesn't it? That's what they want us to think.

Deno J. Andrews wrote...
> He [Gore] is picking the counties, and that is crazy because ALL
> counties have some problems.

How would you, and others like you, feel about ALL counties with less than say a 2% margin, in all states with less than say a 2% margin, being scrutinized very carefully before an official winner is declared? If I thought this could be done quickly enough I'd be all for it.

> So yes, by not accepting the votes as they are, and seeking to have
> votes changed (like the Buchanan votes that are "supposed" to be
> Gore votes) is a basic hurt to democracy, no matter how
> you look at it.

"Seeking to have votes changed" is wording I would disagree with. In exchange I would submit "seeking to determine the voter's actual intent" with the provision that it should be the voters themselves that declare that intent. A manual recount may allow that determination if it's done fairly and openly.

> On another note, what if 2000 or so people were to come forward in Palm
> County and say they voted for Buchanan? Would you think they were lying,
> or would you say, wow...I guess people did vote for Buchanan down there?
> Would that solve the debate?

I don't think it would solve anything. Republicans would probably think the issue was settled, but Democrats would probably assume that it was really 2000 Bush supporters. Since there would be no way to tell for sure, short of an official re-vote, nothing would change except there would be more opportunity for finger pointing.

> I don't mind a delayed vote at all. In fact, I like the hand-count idea.
> There are reps from both parties involved and I believe it will be a fair
> process.

I hope so, although it seems that it may not happen if they can't get it done by tomorrow afternoon.

> The thing that gets me is that the Libs tend to think that all those
> 19000 votes that were disqualified should somehow go to Gore.

Again, I don't really think this is true. They certainly think many of them were meant to go to Gore, but they're trying to determine this via re-counts. I haven't heard anyone suggest that any of these votes should just be arbitrarily switched to Gore.

> Count the votes and move on.

I also think this is the best solution we currently have, but I will be pissed if some serious changes aren't made to our voting and counting processes because of this fiasco. This country could end up with a President that the people didn't really want, and to me that's discraceful even if the President does a fantastic job. Once this election is over there had better be some steps taken to ensure that something like this never happens again.

> Remember, we also have an Electoral College, many of whom do
> not have to vote for the person their constituents voted for.

I don't think this has been given nearly the attention it deserves. I must admit that I was unaware of the elector's leeway in December until this election. I don't understand the reasoning for giving them this lattitude at all. As close as this election is I think the electors had damn well better vote as their constituents did. To do anything else would be unpardonable IMO.

> What do others think of letting the Electoral College in Florida decide? I
> think it is the best way to do it, since they make the final decision
> anyway.

I don't like it. It nullifies the vote of every single person in the state. Is Florida one of the states where the electors can vote their conscience? If so, you're right. They make the final decision anyway.

Deno J. Andrews wrote...
> If we "fix" their votes, there is no democracy as I have stated,
> because there WAS a vote, and whether or not their vote was
> "wrong," it was a vote nonetheless...and changing that for
> anything hurts democracy.

There's something about this attitude - that it's the vote itself, not the accuracy of the vote that's important - that's been bothering me since last week. To me, the physical act of voting is nothing more than the means by which the voters express their preference. If it fails to provide for an accurate expression, yet is allowed to stand anyway, IMO that is what can hurt Democracy.

> [...]
> Our democracy calls for a vote ON election day. That happened
> and the votes are in. As I stated already, if there were mistakes
> in the vote, too bad. The people had their chance to fix their
> mistakes, and they did not. To vote again goes against us, thus
> killing what we know of our democracy.

The same attitude re-stated, but this time warning of killing Democracy instead of just hurting it. I really fail to see how a wrong, yet timely, vote can be preferred over an accurate, yet delayed one. This attitude is one I'll probably never fully understand.

This election has been a wake-up call for Americans, and I know that we all hope that everyone does indeed wake up. I expect some serious voting reform actions the next few years, but that doesn't really help us right now. I'd like to see a national re-vote, but since I fear that it would be subject to the same sloppiness as this one displayed it would be pointless. My next choice would be complete and accurate re-counts of all close states, but I don't think this can be done without partisan finger pointing from both sides, and this could further divide us.

So what do I think should be done? I don't know, this whole thing is a mess. What I do know however, is that the anti-recount and anti-revote people should adopt different slogans than "if there were mistakes in the vote, too bad" and "whether or not the vote was wrong, it was a vote nonetheless." I don't think this attutide is what the framers of the Constitution had in mind.